AI & the Modern Marketing Team
0:14
All right. Hi everyone. Welcome back. I'm Keyiera, uh, social media coordinator
0:20
at Chatterkick. And today we're diving into a conversation that honestly
0:24
everybody's been talking about lately. how to structure a modern marketing team
0:29
with AI in the mix. There's a lot of talk about the tools or the productivity
0:35
hacks and prompts. And we've seen time and time again that I think now people
0:39
are starting to wonder what a marketing team looks like with with AI as a
0:43
teammate. Um, and how leaders should restructure things without losing the
0:49
human side of their brand. That's something that really has been coming up
0:53
a lot in our conversation. So, uh, there's nobody better to have this
0:57
conversation with than Beth. Uh, I'll let you go ahead and introduce yourself.
1:00
>> Yeah. Well, thank you so much. Um, it's great to have a podcast with you. Um,
1:05
Beth Trejo. I'm the CEO and founder of Chatterkick. If we haven't met before,
1:10
um, my I started the company about 14 years ago. And I think I had a natural
1:16
tendency at that time to always uh, chase what was new. And um you know,
1:22
social media is constantly changing and evolving. And I think it was just a
1:26
natural fit as AI came onto the scene that we would try to figure out how to
1:33
leverage it, how to integrate it, and how to keep the human in the right spot
1:39
because that is one of our biggest missions at Chatterkick is human
1:42
connection. And so I'm excited to talk a little bit more about that today.
1:47
>> Yeah, I'm excited too. So, thanks for chatting with me about this. Uh, let's
1:51
start pretty broad because I feel like a lot of people just need to help envision
1:57
that like put themselves into the situation. So, let's talk about how
2:03
someone could envision what this would actually look like for them and their
2:06
team like what does the day-to-day work inside a marketing team look like right
2:11
now with AI? Yeah, I think one of the things that I have noticed even over the
2:18
last probably 10 years, let's even go five years, is a lot of marketing
2:23
leaders, CMOs or they're heading up departments or maybe they're a small
2:28
department, but they're trying to figure out how to bring in partners and
2:31
contractors. Um, but there still was a lot of traditional structure. So that
2:36
typically looked like, you know, your creative team in one silo or one
2:40
category and maybe your paid media team in another category, your email team, um
2:46
maybe you'd have a creative director that would kind of coordinate all of it.
2:49
The actual structure of the marketing departments really didn't vary that
2:53
much. Um, and a lot of it was based in channels, roles, like so you'd have a a
3:00
maybe a social media and then you'd have a direct marketing or whatever it was,
3:04
or you would have them in um, you know, teams. And that's really at Chatterkick
3:10
several years ago, we made that move into the pod model, which really broke
3:15
the boundaries of the traditional role um, of marketing. And we kind of said,
3:21
you know what, this is what we need for social. We need someone who knows
3:24
audiences and analytics. That's one person. We need someone who knew
3:28
community and engagement and could actually interact. Another person, we
3:33
needed somebody who could be that creative vision but also have the the
3:37
the actual ability to do the things. Um, and so we had our visual content
3:42
strategist. And then we needed someone to help glue it all together. Um, and
3:46
then maybe a couple people to help glue it all together. Um, and that's our
3:49
customer success managers. So that particular model had been kind of
3:54
floating around in in some companies in the past. But I think when you look at
3:59
how AI came so fast and is still coming so fast at teams, it really is making
4:05
these marketing leaders understand and really question should we just build it
4:11
better? Could we build it better? And I think that is really what we want to
4:16
answer today is like how can you build it better so that the tools take up the
4:21
right spots and the right space and the people are still there and able to do
4:26
the best things that really only humans or humans are better at these days.
4:32
Yeah, I think um it's important to make the distinction that like the marketing
4:38
team had changed a little bit before AI even came into the mix because I think
4:43
people assume that with AI coming in that it automatically means people are
4:49
getting replaced. Um and a lot of teams are still trying to figure out how the
4:54
work is getting redistributed without AI. So I think it's just like a a part
5:00
that people underestimate that the output
5:04
it can change with AI in the mix but that it's just it's more about how teams
5:09
are spending their time like how the people are spending their time and what
5:12
their roles and responsibilities are within the work that they're doing. It's
5:16
not taking anything away. It's not taking human beings away.
5:22
Uh so let's build on that a little bit. um take it to the next level and add I a
5:28
AI in. How are the marketing roles then
5:32
evolving with AI? Uh do you see any roles or responsibilities growing or
5:39
anything shrinking or disappearing altogether which I think is everybody's
5:43
worst fear,
5:45
>> right? Well, I think you know, obviously different businesses are approaching
5:49
this in multiple ways and I do think that there are businesses that are
5:53
looking to reduce headcount. I'm not necessarily saying that's the right or
5:57
the wrong thing to do, but it's it would be ignorant to say that that's not
6:02
happening in some organizations, but one of the things that I think is the most
6:06
interesting that is happening in teams is just the I would say like drift of
6:12
role clarity. So there's a lot of creative people that maybe they were
6:18
really good at copywriting, right? But they also could do email marketing
6:23
because they could write the emails and they figured out how to deploy the email
6:26
and they could also tinker a little bit in design work, right? And so in the
6:32
past there would be kind of those I would say bold lines on the side where
6:37
maybe that team just they couldn't do it fast enough, they couldn't do it well
6:40
enough, they couldn't get it shipped to the next stage of the marketing process.
6:45
And what's happening now are these tools are taking that bold line and they're
6:49
kind of dampening that a little bit. And so the the individual's skill sets are
6:55
going wider within roles. And that in a positive sense is they get to try, they
7:02
get to learn, they get to build and do new things. On the shadow side of that
7:06
is it becomes a lot of context switching because now you're doing a lot of things
7:11
and you have to kind of remove some of the things from the plate if you want to
7:16
keep piling on even if you have an AI tool in the mix. And so I think that's
7:20
kind of the two dynamics that we're seeing is roles are getting a little bit
7:23
wider and the good side of it. It can it can really increase creativity and
7:28
innovation. And on the other side of it, it can lead to a little bit of mental
7:33
overload, overwhelm, or honestly cost if you're using these tools because they
7:38
can get expensive really quickly.
7:39
>> Yeah. Um, when you think about teams that have adapted the fastest using AI,
7:46
what kind of things do you feel like they understand or like catch on to
7:50
really quickly that help them move quickly and like that? um maybe there
7:56
are things that people are understanding earlier than everybody else.
8:00
>> I think the teams that are getting the most from AI and I don't like to only
8:06
focus on efficiency because I don't think efficiency is actually the fun
8:10
part of AI. I think the creativity is the best part of AI. But I think the
8:14
teams and individuals that are getting the most out of it are those that are
8:19
just used to friction. They're used to friction in their job. They're used to
8:23
friction maybe in their life and they're not afraid to go through some annoying
8:28
work because they see the end and what it could be. And those are the
8:32
individuals that I feel like are just taking these tools and running with
8:36
them. Um, and I think some people are doing it in small doses and that's not a
8:41
bad thing either. I think we need the people to kind of pull the the the ones
8:45
that go fast and furious and those that kind of keep, you know, the the
8:49
consistency and and the steadiness within an organization. But I do see
8:54
that trait of just seeing before doing and then trying to figure out how to get
9:00
there as one of those that really make um someone able to leverage the tools
9:05
and get really good output. Um, are there any rules that you feel
9:10
like you hear people panic about the most um that they think AI is going to
9:15
completely change it or take it away that you don't actually think, you know,
9:19
is a possibility of it being going anywhere anytime soon?
9:24
>> I think that the customer service angle is where a lot of people are trying to
9:29
automate. um meaning whether that's answering phone calls, chat bots, um
9:34
self-s serve information. And I think that that's valuable to a point, but I
9:40
predict that there's going to be companies that just totally revert and
9:45
like push against that. And it's their decision on again where to place the
9:49
technology and the humans. And if they place the tech the humans a little
9:53
closer to their customers, they actually might win even though it's not the most
9:57
time um you know the the time isn't necessarily the lever. It's the
10:04
experience. And I think there's going to be some businesses that see that earlier
10:08
and they're like, you know what, our value is you call us, you get a human.
10:12
>> And I know there I would pay more for something like that in some instances,
10:16
right? like I'm so sick of on phone trees and other instances I'm like you
10:20
know what just give me an FAQ article I'll figure it out myself. So
10:24
>> I do think that the customer service element is is one that is overly
10:29
um weighted as the best spot for AI.
10:34
>> I also think that there are roles that are changing in more of an editing
10:38
space. Um they are doing less of the doing and building and becoming more of
10:44
an editor. And I do think that some people love that because they're like,
10:48
you know what, I like that. I feel like I get to direct and I get to, you know,
10:51
be the the person that steers the ship. And there are some
10:56
people that really don't like it because they their their craft was in the build.
11:00
>> And so I think that some people may shift in terms of their preferences or
11:04
how they want to take roles on. Um, and with all the changes like we're
11:10
talking about, it seems like there are a flood of new job titles popping up from
11:16
companies and businesses that want to hire a person to do this, but they
11:20
really don't know how to list out what the roles and responsibilities are yet.
11:24
There's just like a big umbrella of like, can you do marketing and do you
11:30
know how to use AI? Um, what roles what new roles have you seen that are a good
11:38
a good example or like that you think would be like a really valuable ad to a
11:44
business versus just overall do you do you know how to do you know how to use
11:49
these things like come in and tell us and and run run the show like we trust
11:53
you.
11:54
>> I think that the regardless of the title of the roles I think there's a couple
11:58
commonalities that I see. One is the ability to direct. And I don't mean that
12:05
in just the sense of like some people would call that a strategist. I'm
12:10
talking about being able to understand the weeds enough to really be specific
12:16
about how you think a problem could be solved and then being able to be very
12:23
good at communication skills in making that happen. and then then you have to
12:28
communicate that to the rest of your team. So I really think high quality
12:33
communication skills and that doesn't need to be you know verbal
12:35
communication. It could be a lot of forms of communication but communication
12:39
skills are still going to be extremely valuable and we see that with different
12:42
roles. uh I see uh digital storyteller roles which I think will stand the test
12:48
of time because the tools and technologies can you know come and go
12:52
but telling a really compelling story is an art and even though there is formulas
12:58
for it even though there are tools and and technologies to support it's still
13:04
really hard to tell a story and keep people's attention um even for the best
13:09
narrators out there. So I think that those roles are really interesting in in
13:14
the digital storytelling space. And then I also think that people and businesses
13:21
are trying to hire like people who know AI to come and solve problems. But I
13:28
think that sometimes that's a really hard position again to take if I was
13:33
going into that company and also to um hire for because the you have to know
13:40
the problems you're going to solve regardless of the AI tools. And so
13:46
externally coming in sometimes it's hard to really unearth all of the problems.
13:50
And you may be better off finding just the person who's a really good problem
13:55
solver but just can't get this problem solved. They could be a starting point
13:59
for really helping to kind of build some of your systems and tools using AI.
14:04
>> Yeah, I'm glad you said that about the AI strategist because it does seem like
14:07
that's what everybody wants or is saying that they want, but I think on both ends
14:12
it's difficult to understand what that actually means yet to be an AI
14:17
strategist. Um, one thing I think that a lot of people are struggling with right
14:22
now is where at where AI stops and where like what is the guardrail between the
14:28
human and the AI? If it's is it creativity or like where do the nuances
14:33
and the judgment matter the most? Um, I think it would be helpful to have people
14:38
understand what the humans own and hard stop what AI could take.
14:45
I think that understanding where AI starts and stop or should start or stop
14:51
within a company is a question that I know I don't have the answer to and so
14:55
many businesses don't either because these tools are continuously improving.
15:01
They're evolving. Um I think the best case scenario for
15:06
businesses is to stay curious. help support your teams so that they can
15:13
handle the changes that come their way because that's also exhausting is to
15:17
these constant changes. It's exhausting for leaders and for teams and to just be
15:24
aware and evaluate some of just I'm just going to call it the vibes. What what
15:30
feels right? What feels off? A perfect example of that is I am
15:37
building a tool that now will be able to communicate internally like within a
15:42
slack channel or within a team's channel. And one of the things I
15:46
realized was because it was going to be coming from me, I wanted to make sure
15:50
that the team knew that that message was actually sent by Claude, not by Beth.
15:55
And so it was sent on behalf of Beth. But it's just those little nuances of
16:00
like, hey, this message is sent by Claude from Beth. If there's anything
16:04
that feels off on this, please respond here. But, you know, just deploying
16:10
things blindly feels terrifying to me. And that does feel where we need to have
16:14
some human oversight because you've seen lots of stories where things have gone
16:18
wrong. Uh speaking of of things that that could
16:23
and have gone wrong, do you have any like cautionary tales for uh things that
16:29
you've seen or heard about or experienced yourself when companies
16:33
might be ready to lean into AI, but they maybe lean too heavily in one way or
16:39
another? Yeah, I have been and I'm a pretty fast
16:43
and furious person when it comes to taking risks and, you know, letting
16:49
technologies kind of do the things on my devices or my computers. But I have been
16:55
pretty conservative in how far I'll let the AI tool go in one swoop. So I always
17:03
like to start in a planning mode scenario whether regardless of the tool
17:08
let's get a plan here and as someone who is in high detail but this is really
17:13
important you have to read the output you cannot scan the output before you go
17:19
on to the next step and it it takes discipline I know from my end because I
17:24
just want to go I want to build I want to do these things and that consuming
17:28
and editing of the information is not the fun part for me but I think it's the
17:33
critical part because there are times when I didn't read all the fine print or
17:39
I look at, you know, a recommendation from a plan and I'm like, I don't really
17:42
know what it's talking about. Seems okay. And then I'll ask a follow-up
17:46
question. I'll be like, actually, that's a great question. Maybe we shouldn't do
17:49
that. I like, oh geez, well, I'm glad I asked that question. So, I really think
17:53
that, you know, start in plan mode before you have it take any action on
17:58
your behalf. And then when you have it start taking action on your behalf, do
18:03
it in a very safe environment, meaning it doesn't have a lot of access or it
18:08
wouldn't be a high risk if things went off the rails. Um, you don't want to
18:13
just plug it into a system and say, "Hey, why don't you go ahead and draft
18:18
all those emails for me and responses because that terrifies me."
18:24
>> Yeah. Um, yeah, that would scare me, too. And I do understand that
18:32
being the editor for the output does get to be a bit much, especially when you're
18:36
using it um like quickly or you're trying to just get get to the end like
18:41
you really want the product. Um but that is really important because it's going
18:46
to assume that whatever you just reply to is completely fine and doesn't need
18:50
any edits before he keeps going. So step by step, making sure that you like slow
18:56
down no matter how fast you're going, like slowing down the process. That's
18:59
really good advice. Um, so let's help everybody paint the picture a little bit
19:04
more clearly. In contrast to what we talked about earlier with um what a
19:09
marketing team kind of looks like now and how that's evolving. What does a
19:13
team who wants to stay human centric but include AI actually look like in
19:19
practice? Are there any like tips or things that should be top of mind?
19:23
>> I would think less about the traditional marketing like channels, silos, even
19:29
roles and think more about how do you bring small teams together that have
19:36
complimenting complimementary personalities. So, they don't need to
19:40
all be the same type of people, but how are those small teams going to work
19:45
together and support them with agents or AI or prompts that can be better
19:53
versions of themselves? Oftent times that looks like visibility with data.
19:59
Um, helping them make decisions um from a uh clarity perspective. Um, get some
20:06
of the admin stuff off of them. people spend so much time moving data from one
20:12
spot to another spot, those are great first spots to kind of optimize and
20:16
organize and then also make sure that even though those roles have drift from
20:22
you know one kind of specialty to another I think it's going to be part
20:27
important for all of us to bring that back to the table often and say okay
20:34
realignment we went three months we went six months what do we need to have
20:39
clarity on because I do think that these roles are going to bleed more and more
20:42
into each other and um I think groupings of small teams have always been
20:49
extremely um not only efficient but um there's amazing work that can happen
20:54
when you put people together and support them with the technologies that again
20:59
will hopefully make them um more innovative not just more efficient.
21:05
>> Okay, last question. Um, and honestly probably the biggest one if there are
21:09
any leaders uh listening right now. If a market if a leader of a company wants to
21:15
restructure their business right now um and their marketing team, what's their
21:20
next baby step? Like what's the next easy first step that they could take
21:26
toward their goal of doing that?
21:28
>> Yes. So I think if you are a mark marketing director or a marketing leader
21:34
and you're trying to figure out where do I start my first recommendation is talk
21:39
to your team try to understand their usage of these AI tools and is it might
21:46
be one tool it might be four tools but you really need to get a foundation of
21:50
how much the individual users are comfortable fluent and ready to
21:55
experiment with these tools. I think that baseline alone will help you get a
22:00
good understanding of where you're at and then you can decide where you want
22:05
to be um and how you want to start structuring things either differently or
22:10
maybe it's a slower transition if you're a big enterprise or you know you can go
22:14
faster if you're a smaller business.
22:17
>> Perfect. Uh well thank you Beth. Uh I think this was a great conversation. I
22:23
think people are going to get a lot of value out of it because people honestly
22:27
no matter how fast AI is moving. I think people are always wondering like what do
22:32
I what do I do now? What do I do next? Um it's a lot to keep up with. So um and
22:37
I appreciate that what we added to the conversation was
22:41
that it doesn't have to be fear-based. It doesn't have to be big and scary. uh
22:45
there's opportunity for everyone and for teams to be more intentional about the
22:49
work they're doing and still stay creative and human in the way they work
22:54
and as long as the leaders approach it thoughtfully and carefully um that
22:59
there's a lot of opportunity for everyone. So thanks for sharing your
23:02
perspective on this today. If anyone is watching or listening, um, don't forget
23:08
to connect with Beth on LinkedIn and follow Chatterkick for more
23:12
conversations like this about marketing and leadership and the future of social
23:16
media. Uh, if there's a topic you'd love for us to cover, just let us know in the
23:20
comments. Thanks everyone. We'll see you next time.
23:23
Thanks.